Printed from the blog of Lori Greene, AHC/CDC, CCPR, FDAI
Allegion
Email: lori_greene@allegion.com, Blog: www.idighardware.com or www.ihatehardware.com


May 23 2014

FF: Closer Magic

Category: Door ClosersLori @ 12:50 am Comments (25)
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I think I’ve mentioned before, I love working with our specwriter apprentices.  They may not know much about hardware on Day 1, but they make up for it with their enthusiasm and the ability to absorb information (I lost that a long time ago).  They don’t have any baggage, they don’t go off on a tangent talking about how things were in the Olden Days, and they have no problem sitting in a classroom soaking it all in.  I especially love taking them on field trips and pointing out hardware in its natural habitat.  They even tolerate me when I make them do a scavenger hunt for various types of hardware in an art museum, or throw tea overboard in a reenactment of the Boston Tea Party so I can show them a complicated egress plan.  I’m excited to meet this year’s group soon!

Since I’m one of their first connections in the hardware world, I’m one of the go-to people for some of their questions (like when a duckling hatches and bonds with the first thing it sees).  They know that I won’t judge them if they ask a rookie question, and of course I’m always looking for photos and they’re a great source.

Eric Paul, one of the Allegion specwriter apprentices, sent me today’s Fixed-it Friday photo wondering how this closer is mounted and I’m at a loss for answers.  Maybe I should have saved it for Wordless Wednesday.  It’s attached somehow because the door is functional.  I’m sure one of you has done something like this before.  Glue?  Double-sided tape?  Magic?  Help me help Eric out!  🙂

Closer Mounted on Glass

25 Responses to “FF: Closer Magic”

  1. Paul M. Goldense says:

    Lori

    3M high bond tape. If you have never used it, think of double stick tape on a double dose of steroids! if you tape two pieces of aluminum tube together with it and try to separate them, the aluminum will break before the tape will fail. It can easily hold this closer onto the glass door. Just position the closer correctly the first time as there is no second time. The tape is clear so you would likely not notice it. They probably trimmed the tape around the closer footprint.

    • Lori says:

      See…I KNEW someone would know! I think I need some of that tape – I just noticed that one of the refrigerator drawers is busted. I’ll just have to hide it from the kids or there could be trouble.

      Thanks Paul!

  2. Jess says:

    Lori,

    Just noticed this one, I will want to thank Michael (friend in Hong Kong) for showing this one to me during a google+ hangout, (I have not been to your site since yesterday) as for how that LCN is stuck to that door, I am thinking clear construction adhesive?? they probably laid a line of the goo, then put closer on it (i hope they set the backcheck SELECTION VALVE)

    also, is there a way that you can get Eric Paul to upload a video of this door in action??

    looking at that closer alittle CLOSER, (haha pun) look at the bolt hole locations, the 2 near the spring tube, no black dots (thru bolted or empty) it looks like as if the clear adhesive filled the 2 holes and didn’t fill the other 2 (near sweep and latch valves)

    as for the closer hunting and hardware talk, I love finding new hardware and seeing them “in the wild” ohh man, if I ever crossed paths with you Lori, I’m sure you would be asking if I ever did take a class and not told anyone!

    -Jess the door closer doctor

  3. Jason says:

    PIXIE DUST OF COURSE!!!!

  4. Ritzo says:

    It has been photoshopped, they are laughing at all of us!!!

    • Jess says:

      I would like to see video of this door and this closer on it,

      due to how blurry it is, (digital zoom??) it is hard to tell if it was Photoshopped and digitally “mounted” to the glass.

      also, if this was adhesive or double sided tape, would you see the tape on the glass where its holding the closer on??

      another hunch is that if this closer is hanging by its arm, (if it was the Parallel rigid arm) it would hang level or close to level like this.

      the arm that is in use here is the RW/PA arm, so if the closer was really hanging by its arm, it would not be level.

      not intending on sounding mean or nasty or negative to the person who sent this photo to Lori, its just too easy on the internet these days to tamper with a photo then submit it to a website or owner of a website.

      -Jess

      • Lori says:

        I will work on a video Jess, although it’s a bank so they may not like to see someone videotaping their door. As I said in my post, this photo came from one of the apprentices…I don’t think he would take the time to create a photo and then ask me to help him understand the mounting.

    • Lori says:

      I don’t think so…I’m working on getting more photos or a video.

  5. David says:

    I can’t wait to try this!

  6. Liz Lenox says:

    A mounting plate for the backside of the closer would have been nice, unless seeing the closer guts was part of the aesthetic they were looking for! LOL..

    • Jess says:

      Liz, it actually was a “naked” LCN 4040 that got me interested in closers when I was 12,

      also about same age I noticed some golden finish closers at a restaurant and once grabbed a chair, stood on it to try to read the label on the inside of the cover of a closer that was similar to the Falcon SC-71, I then got caught by one of my aunts or someone and after that, I ended up getting the “don’t do this, don’t do that” lecture whenever I went anywhere fancy.

      and yes, I did learn not to take notice of hardware in such a big way, (and embarrass myself in the process) I now wear glasses to see better with and no longer need a chair to stand on to read the adjustment instructions on closers that were installed without the backplate (for LCN, it is the 4040-18)

      -Jess the door closer doctor

  7. Chris Bird says:

    I think this is a good example of invisible sex bolts.

  8. Wayne Ficklin says:

    You build a better mouse trap and they build a better mouse!!

  9. David Barbaree says:

    It is hard to tell given the picture resolution but it appears to me that there is NO door in place. You can see the door mount side of the top pivot and possibly even screws that attached the pivot to the door. But there is no indication that a frameless door is in the opening. Plus I have never see any type of glass that has screw attached into the edge like that. I suspect the door was removed with the closer left hanging and this is a gag or misunderstood picture.
    Am I all wet?

    • Lori says:

      There’s a door in place and the door and closer operate. I will work on a video for all of you Doubting Thomases! 🙂

      • David Barbaree says:

        Good, and try to get a close up of the hinge mounts. Maybe it’s not glass but rather some sort of transparent aluminum. This is possible. I know from watching Star Trek IV – The Voyage Home. 🙂

  10. Lee Francisco says:

    I’m going to have to put myself in the Doubting Thomas group. You can see the entire door leaf of the pivot. Looks like it’s hanging a little crooked to me.

  11. Kasey H says:

    Excited to meet you also Lori!

  12. Tom Breese says:

    3M Hi-Bond tape: really good to know, Paul! I’d otherwise advise against retrofitting SNB at this point… 😎

  13. David Barbaree says:

    Hi Lori,
    Just a reminder that we are still looking forward to seeing that better picture or video you promised. 🙂
    Sincerely,
    D. Thomas

  14. Jack says:

    If the picture is real, why would they not use the 4040XP-18PA drop down plate with the 1/4″ bolts cut flush?, this would give much improved adhesion from Plate to glass as well as aesthetics 🙂

  15. Carlos says:

    I agree with David’s assesment. Its obivious to me that the door with the drop down mounting plate has been removed!

  16. Carlos says:

    Hello Lori,
    Normally I’m a faith based person, but in this case I would have to see it to believe it. Basically there are two things that I’m having difficulty with in the photo.
    1. In the photo there appears to be a shadow from a head reveal like as if a door was slightly open, but the top half of the pivot is mounted on it. So that can’t be the door.
    2. The arm of the closer appears to be past the preloaded position like as if it was resting prior to the installation.

    In closing, since we can not prove it one way or the other, I guess we will have no closure (pun intended)on this one.

    Have a good and safe New Years!

  17. DAVID FEDERICO says:

    I have used 3M VHB adhesive I have actually installed a panic exit device to a single tempered glass door with a HES 9500 rim mounted electric strike (Glass door wood frame ) and the result was great . As a result of this I got lots of work from this group for thinking out side the Box . Of course this was used as an access control door complete with card reader on a non fire rated assembly .

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